We have now been looking after Casper for 4 days...it really seems like 4 weeks! Some clues about him are now emerging through behaviours exhibited, recall, heel work, general manners.. etc..It is clear he knows none of the above with respect to training. He has however an overwhelming desire to please, almost desperate. It is also clear his threshold for distractions is pretty low, almost non-existent. I am thinking this might partly be due to the fact we are still in the early phase of settling down, so when push comes to shove he sees another dog then...bloody hell he aint half fast! Like a streak of lightening off he goes! He thunders off...and disappers a teeny black blob on the horizon..sigh..and I thought Benson was bad?...boy oh boy... ;D ;D First things first..his name..we are sticking with Casper. At the moment I don't want to work on anything else beyond recognition of his name, I don't know if this is the correct way forward, but it feels right. Overloading him with new info and commands I am not sure is a good thing, however he knows a sit, so we are using that to gain a good positive response and opportunity to reward. He now knows a clicker is a good thing. So, I take the dogs down the driveway and use 2 words only, the clicker, and kibble as treats. oh and a smile! I am trying to avoid using any other words, as my instinct is let him read my body language, I want to bring his natural attentiveness out. With both dogs I call either name and click when they look at me, then throw a treat. I think this is helping keeping Casper close and also I think after this morning some glimmer of understanding is reaching his lovely dark brown eyes! Hurrah! Any input from forum members is greatly appreciated, please if you think we are doing something wrong or an approach, method needs tweaking that would be greatly appreciated!
Re: Teaching an old dog new tricks.. My approach would be to take him out on his own for training sessions without Benson to get a bond established with him. Rather than boring old kibble I would get the smelliest tastiest wet food and hand feed him all his food rations. Also a long training line attached to a harness so that you can reinforce the recall if necessary and prevent him legging in off to see another dog. I took on a rescue dog a few years ago and the hand feeding gave me the bond I was hoping for. It took many months though.
Re: Teaching an old dog new tricks.. Kate,you absolutely know I am no help at all having only had the one dog from scratch but I think you are approaching it right by keeping things really simple...I also think it's a great idea to encourage him to LOOK to you and what you are doing with your body language. For massively different reasons I've been really working on Dexter looking at me for the last few weeks,it's really sharpened everything up.....at first I was rewarding every opportunity I could....if I walked in the room and he lifted his head and looked at me he got a biscuit....if I was in the garden talking on the phone and he looked I rewarded him.....we've both been watching each other a lot ;D he's really looking at me now to see what I want him to do. We are lucky on the Forum that we've got so many members that have rescued so let's see what advice comes up X
Re: Teaching an old dog new tricks.. Good for you to be doing this and giving that boy another chance. The only thought I had was that I would try and reward voluntary attention rather than a response to his name (do that as well of course). So C&T for looking at you - his choice to pay attention to you, and watch what you are doing.
Re: Teaching an old dog new tricks.. I think you are approaching this just right Beanwood. He sounds a lovely dog and I am sure you will get over his problems. I had a rescue dog some years ago and took him to the top of the Malvern Hills about a couple of days after I got him (he was a nervous wreck) and I let him off the lead. He was a German Shorthaired Pointer and they range!! When he went one way, I turned and went the other and he could be well over a hundred yards away in seconds, I gambled on his need to be with me was greater than his need to be 'out there' and it worked. I didn't use a long line as I wanted him to learn for himself; I have also had experience with long lines and the dogs behave perfectly on them but as soon as you take them off they revert.
Re: Teaching an old dog new tricks.. Morning Kate, we did as Heidrun suggested to us, hand feeding was as I always say the best piece of advice we were ever given We did this for many, many months and Charlie knew he had to earn his food coming from us not his bowl, the bond grew so much it was lovely . Harness and long line a definite for reinforcing recall if was a life saver for us and Charlie, although Casper is no way near as bad as Charlie was . We also did all of Charlie's training on his own with lots of smelly treats and no distractions from Hattie. Voluntary attention as Julie said gets a treat and a 'good boy' and a fuss too. I found it helped me to log Charlie's progress which didn't take much paper at all ;D I could look back at what I needed to work harder on and I also I eventually condensed my training into the 3 most important/vital skills at a time for us otherwise and Charlie or I felt I was drowning in training and getting nowhere fast. Your doing a great job xxx
Re: Teaching an old dog new tricks.. All sounding very good and positive Kate When Millie came to us last year , a former stray , it became apparent very quickly that she would do absolutely anything for food . I used this as a training tool , hotdog sausages were fantastic as the smelled good ( to her ) as well as tasting great ( to her ) . However , the novelty began to wear off but was quickly replaced by an overwhelming desire to retrieve tennis balls , she had observed Sam retrieving and wanted some of the action for herself . Thankfully she does not bother with his dummy at all , so I can have them both together , he with dummy and her with a ball but it may be better for you to work with Casper on his own, just for short sessions . Loads of luck, its so rewarding when it all comes together x
Re: Teaching an old dog new tricks.. I can't offer any advice, but wanted to say well done to you both. What you are doing is fantastic and the training you are doing sounds really well thought out. Look forward to meeting him
Re: Teaching an old dog new tricks.. I saw the photo you posted of Casper the other day kate he is a beauty. ;D Not sure i will be much help but I think what you are doing sounds a very good place to start. Although I haven't had a rescue dog we have three in my extended family. All different mixes of all sorts but rather than structured training to begin with we played with them to see what they enjoyed doing and what motivated them. The two terrier crosses love retrieving and Harry would much rather have a retrieve as a reward than food. Pip is the opposite. The fact casper wants to please is a bonus to work with and getting him to look at you is a good thing to train. I agree with Heidrun about spending some time training him or just playing with him on his own to bond. With my two I train new stuff individually then bring them together but I've had them from pups so now for most things they are together. Two dogs same age, same litter often bond more with each other which is the problem. I've been very careful but that shouldn't be as much of a problem with benson and Casper. I hope it goes really well for you all looking forward to updates. ;D
Re: Teaching an old dog new tricks.. OK - so before SWMBO get's home, here's my quick update on Casper for you all. I was left strict instructions ; "Walk him up the driveway, don't talk to him, and confuse him with different commands. As you say his name, when he turns to look at you 'click' then treat." Easy enough - even I can do that ! Well - the little monkey obviously adores me! He would NOT take his eyes off me AT ALL, even whilst walking to a perfect (Unasked for) heel! When he (Eventually) did look away, he'd look back every two seconds just in case there was food available - before I had a chance to call his name ??? I feel somehow I have failed - I might have to try this with a few more distractions.... But I know this close attention is short lived, and this evening, it will be me running across a field to try and retrieve him again.... Ho hum - lol.
Re: Teaching an old dog new tricks.. Now don't be so sceptical maybe Casper is a mans dog and his adoration of you will never diminish. Just incase though make sure you've got your running shoes on. ;D
Re: Teaching an old dog new tricks.. Just want to say a huge thank you for all your supportive comments and great ideas! The best one being from Jen...now then, thinking heads together on the right type of running shoes for hubby! ;D [quote author=heidrun link=topic=8180.msg115515#msg115515 date=1412756721] My approach would be to take him out on his own for training sessions without Benson to get a bond established with him. Rather than boring old kibble I would get the smelliest tastiest wet food and hand feed him all his food rations. Also a long training line attached to a harness so that you can reinforce the recall if necessary and prevent him legging in off to see another dog. I took on a rescue dog a few years ago and the hand feeding gave me the bond I was hoping for. It took many months though. [/quote] Yes, we will be taking Casper out for more individual training, and he loves being hand fed! His favourite is hot chicken and frankfurters. The brief sessions is a bit of kibble, and high value when we are out with more distractions [quote author=Stacia link=topic=8180.msg115525#msg115525 date=1412758685] I had a rescue dog some years ago and took him to the top of the Malvern Hills about a couple of days after I got him (he was a nervous wreck) and I let him off the lead. He was a German Shorthaired Pointer and they range!! When he went one way, I turned and went the other and he could be well over a hundred yards away in seconds, I gambled on his need to be with me was greater than his need to be 'out there' and it worked. I didn't use a long line as I wanted him to learn for himself; I have also had experience with long lines and the dogs behave perfectly on them but as soon as you take them off they revert. [/quote] He is better behaved when there aren't any other dogs around..he gets very excited and will leg it just to say hello, hoping this will recede a bit as he gets used to regular walks, and equally gets used to the fact he is allowed lots of opportunites to meet other dogs [quote author=kateincornwall link=topic=8180.msg115545#msg115545 date=1412765446] All sounding very good and positive Kate When Millie came to us last year , a former stray , it became apparent very quickly that she would do absolutely anything for food . I used this as a training tool , hotdog sausages were fantastic as the smelled good ( to her ) as well as tasting great ( to her ) . However , the novelty began to wear off but was quickly replaced by an overwhelming desire to retrieve tennis balls , she had observed Sam retrieving and wanted some of the action for herself . Thankfully she does not bother with his dummy at all , so I can have them both together , he with dummy and her with a ball but it may be better for you to work with Casper on his own, just for short sessions . Loads of luck, its so rewarding when it all comes together x [/quote] At the moment he doesn't seem to have much interest in tennis balls, loves to play in the house with toys though. Interestingly Benson now has a MUCH higher retrieving drive. Luckily right now he is very food orientated, he is also on a diet, so acting like he is half starved atm ;D [quote author=Jen link=topic=8180.msg115577#msg115577 date=1412775800] I saw the photo you posted of Casper the other day kate he is a beauty. ;D The fact casper wants to please is a bonus to work with and getting him to look at you is a good thing to train. I agree with Heidrun about spending some time training him or just playing with him on his own to bond. [/quote] Yes, I think his eagerness to please is really going to help his progress, and yes Casper will be spending a bit more time one to one, although tbh not sure he needs it with hubby! :
Re: Teaching an old dog new tricks.. Quick video from last night, he recall is not bad when no other dogs are around, we will work more on this without Benson or have me holding Benson in a settle, which we did practice. Yes clicker timing probably not perfect! You can who he is naturally more responsive to...I get an amble, and Casper races back to OH! ;D He has also lost a little weight already. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCyrcKwH3Eo
Re: Teaching an old dog new tricks.. He is gorgeous Kate. ;D I'm afraid I think he might well be a mans dog. Harry is like that my OH or my cousins OH appears and we become invisible. :. Never mind he's my cousins dog and she feeds, exercises etc and I exercise him every day. Some dogs just love men . : He did very well. ;D You will be able to use benson to start proofing Casper against other dogs as well. ;D
Re: Teaching an old dog new tricks.. I do hope you keep Casper. Both dogs look super together and you can see that Casper is getting a waist. Do you know how old Casper is and do you have any idea of where he has come from and any history?
Re: Teaching an old dog new tricks.. Update: Casper is doing well, heelwork is improving surprisingly quickly both on and off lead, not that this is a main focus, but naturally this is evolving from the initial training his name. I find it helps with the bonding and structure of our time together. OH has not problem..sticks to him like glue...sigh... Got a little video of some off lead work in the middle of a field with no distractions using a clicker and a couple of direction changes thrown in Did have an anxious moment when I thought he had run off, but actually I must've missed him and thought he had run down a lane into an estate. On my way back a couple said they had him...and that he was desperately trying to get back to me when he heard me calling. Off lead work.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45_pd5BWcJw Recall coming along very quickly, helped by the fact he is a real foodie! Yesterday his recall was better than Benson... : Not sure that says very much... : ;D Major milestone today, our wonderful dog walker took him out and he met the regular group, was a good boy and no problem with taking him on so now booked in with Benson on his regular off lead walks with them and his mates Final hurdle we still need to work on is anxiety/separation. So far we have been able to leave him up to one and a half hours, which is great considering the first few days Marcus had to be in the same room as him or he got very distressed.. We need Caper to be happy with a maximum of 3 hours. Gradually we extending the time he is left, we are not pushing it as don't want to cause any stress, especially as we are working hard on bonding and trust. In this case a lot of patience is called for and probably time, the more settled he feels the less likely he will feel we have abandoned him. Other areas, such as cats, other dogs he is a real gentleman! Not interested in eating poo, but does enjoy a little recreational roll...
Re: Teaching an old dog new tricks.. Sounds like he is doing really well, thanks to your hard work and patience
Re: Teaching an old dog new tricks.. Really great to read of your progress , very well done to you all
Re: Teaching an old dog new tricks.. Sounds great. He seems to be settling in well, and he certainly has no problem focussing on you ;D
